Comments on: Two flavour pairing case studies http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/ - dedicated to molecular gastronomy Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:38:20 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 By: blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #9: Chocolate tagliatelle with parmesan cream http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-73552 blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #9: Chocolate tagliatelle with parmesan cream Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:13:26 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-73552 [...] Grissini Wrapped in Prosciutto di Parma) by Masaharu Morimoto which I’ve blogged about previously. I was quite intrigued by that recipe and wanted to try it! So here it is, converted to metric [...] […] Grissini Wrapped in Prosciutto di Parma) by Masaharu Morimoto which I’ve blogged about previously. I was quite intrigued by that recipe and wanted to try it! So here it is, converted to metric […]

]]> By: blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #9: Parmesan and cocoa http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-67665 blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #9: Parmesan and cocoa Sat, 09 Feb 2008 11:30:33 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-67665 [...] lamiacucina is hosting TGRWT #9 and the foods to pair this time are parmesan and cocoa. I’ve previously blogged about this combination and odor activity values (OAV) are available for both parmesan and cocoa. These are the molecules [...] […] lamiacucina is hosting TGRWT #9 and the foods to pair this time are parmesan and cocoa. I’ve previously blogged about this combination and odor activity values (OAV) are available for both parmesan and cocoa. These are the molecules […]

]]> By: TGRWT #9: Stinkmorchel und ranzige Butter? | molekularkueche http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-67393 TGRWT #9: Stinkmorchel und ranzige Butter? | molekularkueche Fri, 08 Feb 2008 17:02:16 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-67393 [...] macht den (ekligen) Geschmack. In geringen Mengen und in der richtigen Kombination ergeben die oben aufgeführten Geruchsstoffe nämlich durchaus angenehme Lebensmittel: Kakao und Parmesankäse. Das klingt doch schon deutlich [...] […] macht den (ekligen) Geschmack. In geringen Mengen und in der richtigen Kombination ergeben die oben aufgeführten Geruchsstoffe nämlich durchaus angenehme Lebensmittel: Kakao und Parmesankäse. Das klingt doch schon deutlich […]

]]> By: blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » Foodpairing website launched http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-47301 blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » Foodpairing website launched Wed, 21 Nov 2007 23:20:55 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-47301 [...] of volatile compounds they have in common, not the actual key odorants. As I have elaborated on previously, pairings like these should preferably be based on odor activity values (OAV). Or to put it [...] […] of volatile compounds they have in common, not the actual key odorants. As I have elaborated on previously, pairings like these should preferably be based on odor activity values (OAV). Or to put it […]

]]> By: blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #7: Cocoa frico with cauliflower cream http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-40427 blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #7: Cocoa frico with cauliflower cream Sun, 28 Oct 2007 20:59:43 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-40427 [...] I wanted to make a cauliflower cream and serve it with something crispy. Considering the fact that cocoa and parmesan are also a good match I googled for parmesan crisps and found a nice recipe for “frico” - Italian parmesan [...] […] I wanted to make a cauliflower cream and serve it with something crispy. Considering the fact that cocoa and parmesan are also a good match I googled for parmesan crisps and found a nice recipe for “frico” - Italian parmesan […]

]]> By: blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #5: Chocolate and meat http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-28179 blog.khymos.org » Blog Archive » TGRWT #5: Chocolate and meat Sat, 04 Aug 2007 23:07:31 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-28179 [...] and roasted beef. All flavour compounds were ranked and compounds given the same color coding as before. As you can see, there is considerable overlap between chocolate and [...] […] and roasted beef. All flavour compounds were ranked and compounds given the same color coding as before. As you can see, there is considerable overlap between chocolate and […]

]]> By: Martin Lersch http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-14169 Martin Lersch Sun, 13 May 2007 07:06:41 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-14169 Mirko, that's a very good observation! An interesting approach to flavour pairing would be to look at the vibrations in the aroma molecules. Perhaps one day cooking will be all about pairing the right vibrations (oohh - that sounds very esoteric...). But I think it will be a number of years until we're there and able to extract any useful information from such an analysis. Too little is known about the vibration theory, how the receptors work and how we actually smell. So for the time beeing, flavour pairing based on key odorants will still be helpful when searching for foods that are quite similar from a chemical viewpoint due to key odorants present, but whose similarity many don't think about or recognize due to our nose's limited ability to analyze and dissect a smell sensation into it's individual components I should quickly add that a lack of overlap between key odorants does <i>not</i> mean that two foods will not go well together! And I should point out that I did not dismiss the mango-cocoa combination, only state that there is a lack of odour overlap. I'm quite sure that they go very well together! All in all, we should not expect that the search for foods with similar key odorants will give result in a large number of new combinations. In fact, the flavour pairing "theory" can only explain a tiny amount of all the flavour combinations that excist. But I still think it's worth finding those few combinations we otherwise would have missed. Mirko, that’s a very good observation! An interesting approach to flavour pairing would be to look at the vibrations in the aroma molecules. Perhaps one day cooking will be all about pairing the right vibrations (oohh - that sounds very esoteric…). But I think it will be a number of years until we’re there and able to extract any useful information from such an analysis. Too little is known about the vibration theory, how the receptors work and how we actually smell.

So for the time beeing, flavour pairing based on key odorants will still be helpful when searching for foods that are quite similar from a chemical viewpoint due to key odorants present, but whose similarity many don’t think about or recognize due to our nose’s limited ability to analyze and dissect a smell sensation into it’s individual components

I should quickly add that a lack of overlap between key odorants does not mean that two foods will not go well together! And I should point out that I did not dismiss the mango-cocoa combination, only state that there is a lack of odour overlap. I’m quite sure that they go very well together!

All in all, we should not expect that the search for foods with similar key odorants will give result in a large number of new combinations. In fact, the flavour pairing “theory” can only explain a tiny amount of all the flavour combinations that excist. But I still think it’s worth finding those few combinations we otherwise would have missed.

]]> By: Mirko Junge http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-14024 Mirko Junge Sat, 12 May 2007 02:01:33 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-14024 You are persuing a great way of analysis. But after having read Luca Turins 'The Secret of Sense' you <a href="http://blog.khymos.org/category/luca-turin/" rel="nofollow">featured</a> a while ago. Your 4 point summary is very much to the point: (point 3 of 4) we smell functional groups. Your more 'semantic' analysis of the names of the chemical 'structures' seems to be a bit much of a short cut, doesn't it? Should you not 'disect' the compounds into their functional groups and redo the comparision? I think this step is warrented, because of your dismissal of the chocolate-mango combination which I think works particuarly well in form of the <a href="http://drjunge.blogspot.com/2006/05/schokoladen-mousse-nach-von-gavel_27.html" rel="nofollow">'Chocolate Mouse'</a> and 'Mango Puree' (mango, sugar and mix in a blender). Of cause your dismissal of the chocolate-mango combination could be due to the <a href="http://www.slashfood.com/2007/05/04/indian-mangoes-have-come-to-the-us/" rel="nofollow">differences in mangos</a> or just a 'failure' to the theory. You are persuing a great way of analysis. But after having read Luca Turins ‘The Secret of Sense’ you featured a while ago. Your 4 point summary is very much to the point: (point 3 of 4) we smell functional groups. Your more ’semantic’ analysis of the names of the chemical ’structures’ seems to be a bit much of a short cut, doesn’t it? Should you not ‘disect’ the compounds into their functional groups and redo the comparision?

I think this step is warrented, because of your dismissal of the chocolate-mango combination which I think works particuarly well in form of the ‘Chocolate Mouse’ and ‘Mango Puree’ (mango, sugar and mix in a blender). Of cause your dismissal of the chocolate-mango combination could be due to the differences in mangos or just a ‘failure’ to the theory.

]]> By: Fred http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13369 Fred Tue, 08 May 2007 23:05:19 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13369 Here's the recipe translated, have fun !! Fred :) 30 g parmeggiano (0,5 Oz or 0,33 lb ??) 100g chocolate (70%) 1 pinch of Guerande sea salt (or better : fleur de sel or Maldon salt) 2 or 3 pinch of pepper, freshly ground Grate parmeggiano and spread if on a baking sheet. Pre-heat oven to 150°C (300°F) and bake it for 10 minutes until color glodens. Let it cool at room temperature. Melt chocolate (if you want to have it shiny and more resistant to temperature modifications you need to follow the temperature curve in order to "temper" it : heat to 55°C then stir to cool the chocolate to 28°C and re-heat it to 31°C but if you don't care just melt it gently till 55°C max) Mix with salt, pepper and parmeggiano. Taste and add more salt/pepper... to your taste. Pour on a baking sheet, put another baking sheet on top of it and press it in order to get a thin sheet of chocolate of about 2mm thick. Let it cool until it hardens. When the chocolate is hard enough, break it in triangles. You can keep it for 3 days. Here’s the recipe translated, have fun !! Fred :)

30 g parmeggiano (0,5 Oz or 0,33 lb ??)
100g chocolate (70%)
1 pinch of Guerande sea salt (or better : fleur de sel or Maldon salt)
2 or 3 pinch of pepper, freshly ground

Grate parmeggiano and spread if on a baking sheet. Pre-heat oven to 150°C (300°F) and bake it for 10 minutes until color glodens. Let it cool at room temperature.
Melt chocolate (if you want to have it shiny and more resistant to temperature modifications you need to follow the temperature curve in order to “temper” it : heat to 55°C then stir to cool the chocolate to 28°C and re-heat it to 31°C but if you don’t care just melt it gently till 55°C max)
Mix with salt, pepper and parmeggiano. Taste and add more salt/pepper… to your taste.
Pour on a baking sheet, put another baking sheet on top of it and press it in order to get a thin sheet of chocolate of about 2mm thick. Let it cool until it hardens.
When the chocolate is hard enough, break it in triangles. You can keep it for 3 days.

]]> By: Jurgen http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13335 Jurgen Tue, 08 May 2007 18:48:36 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13335 The central question is this, I think: Why do we percieve a flavor as pleasant? My thoughts; Obviously, all food consists of a mixture of flavors. I think we learn that these mixes are pleasant. Children in general prefer bland food. Our taste is in my opinion therefore a psychological phenomenon rather than biology or chemistry. If this is true the flavor p[airing hypothesis is right, combining similar flavors will yield dishes that reminds us of things we know. And this will taste well. Strong overwhelming flavors will overrule any similarities of course. On the other hand, the biological perception of flavor will not be the same for everybody. As our taste is generated by 350 different olfactory receptors, differences in expression levels of these receptors will give different taste perceptions. Some polymorphisms in taste are well described, bitterness perception for instance. The central question is this, I think: Why do we percieve a flavor as pleasant?
My thoughts; Obviously, all food consists of a mixture of flavors. I think we learn that these mixes are pleasant. Children in general prefer bland food. Our taste is in my opinion therefore a psychological phenomenon rather than biology or chemistry.
If this is true the flavor p[airing hypothesis is right, combining similar flavors will yield dishes that reminds us of things we know. And this will taste well. Strong overwhelming flavors will overrule any similarities of course.
On the other hand, the biological perception of flavor will not be the same for everybody. As our taste is generated by 350 different olfactory receptors, differences in expression levels of these receptors will give different taste perceptions. Some polymorphisms in taste are well described, bitterness perception for instance.

]]> By: Trig http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13126 Trig Mon, 07 May 2007 16:35:26 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-13126 Reading about Masaharu Morimoto it's obvious that he's a very creative and talented chef with a great story to tell. His recipe for chocolate pasta sounds very intriguing and one I'd love to cook and eat. Reading about Masaharu Morimoto it’s obvious that he’s a very creative and talented chef with a great story to tell. His recipe for chocolate pasta sounds very intriguing and one I’d love to cook and eat.

]]> By: Martin Lersch http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-12983 Martin Lersch Sun, 06 May 2007 10:10:07 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-12983 Would be great if you could translate the recipe! Would be great if you could translate the recipe!

]]> By: Fred http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-12975 Fred Sun, 06 May 2007 09:16:41 +0000 http://blog.khymos.org/2007/05/05/two-flavour-pairing-case-studies/#comment-12975 It's a very intersting subject indeed. Matching products odorant and adding concentration as parameter may then be, one day, the key to find out about new cooking experiences ?? By the way : Parmeggian and chocolate is actually a great match, have you tried these : http://scally.typepad.com/cest_moi_qui_lai_fait/2006/12/eclats_de_choco.html it's awesome. If you don't read french I'll be glad to translate it for you :) Frédérique. It’s a very intersting subject indeed. Matching products odorant and adding concentration as parameter may then be, one day, the key to find out about new cooking experiences ??

By the way : Parmeggian and chocolate is actually a great match, have you tried these : http://scally.typepad.com/cest_moi_qui_lai_fait/2006/12/eclats_de_choco.html it’s awesome.
If you don’t read french I’ll be glad to translate it for you :)
Frédérique.

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